tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13622622.post8995231189761961489..comments2023-12-22T08:44:24.389-05:00Comments on threewayfight: Ammon Bundy, the refugee caravan, and Patriot movement race politicsMatthew N Lyonshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15664330735255207352noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13622622.post-5113459713347736822020-07-21T12:59:03.626-04:002020-07-21T12:59:03.626-04:00Ammon Bundy speaks to why he is joining the Black ...Ammon Bundy speaks to why he is joining the Black Lives Matters at the Defund the Police Rally:<br />https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1lqgCEQy9s&feature=youtu.be&fbclid=IwAR0Um7umcj4qBawz7ZszwTo3U7rl1xvt8Wm0B0jM5okPAPMD3EhVKsmuk6gMatthew N Lyonshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15664330735255207352noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13622622.post-89448896327726158742019-03-14T08:50:44.772-04:002019-03-14T08:50:44.772-04:00Thanks, John. Your points are well taken.Thanks, John. Your points are well taken.Matthew N Lyonshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15664330735255207352noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13622622.post-67140660860753382472019-03-13T17:44:41.797-04:002019-03-13T17:44:41.797-04:00Thank you for your explanation. I think your point...Thank you for your explanation. I think your point about things being a little more complex than many like to think regarding both the Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers is important to keep in mind. It's also important to keep in mind that even this somewhat more nuanced and less explicitly racist approach is still reactionary. I know some - mainly but not exclusively anarchists - who sympathize with the Malheur occupation because it's "against" the government. There is a similar sympathy for the Oath Keepers' presence in Ferguson. They picture that presence as being in armed self defense - something similar to the rolThey may have spoken for free speech rights, but that's not why they were there. They were there to encourage what amounts to a "shoot on sight" approach to anybody who destroyed property. Vigilante "justice" in other words. While I don't support looting and burning, I would point out this: After the QT store was burned to the ground, that lot became a central gathering place, a community center of sorts where the community met, discussed, shared food and music, etc. And completely aside from that, I think we'd all agree that we would not support shooting looters. I recognize that you don't say anything to the contrary, but I think it's useful to make that explicit.JOHN REIMANNhttp://oaklandsocialist.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13622622.post-67513810990800566132019-03-13T17:08:13.714-04:002019-03-13T17:08:13.714-04:00John, thanks for your comment. In the Ammon Bundy ...John, thanks for your comment. In the Ammon Bundy piece, and in the August 2015 piece about Oath Keepers and Ferguson that it references, I am NOT claiming that Oath Keepers has upheld anti-racist politics or was “an ally of the Ferguson protesters.” I am arguing that Oath Keepers and the Patriot movement as a whole embody an interplay and conflict between explicit white supremacism and the ideology of “color-blindness.” Color-blindness hides—and thereby protects—the continuing reality of racial oppression, but it is very different from white supremacist ideology and requires a different response.<br /><br />I agree that Oath Keepers puts a big emphasis on defending property rights, and that its invoking of the Deacons for Defense appropriates that legacy for ends that are fundamentally at odds with what the Deacons stood for. Nevertheless, calling on black people to practice organized, armed self-defense breaks with a core tenet of white supremacist ideology. Further, as I document in the August 2015 piece, Oath Keepers did in fact speak out publicly in defense of the Ferguson community’s right to protest, and publicly denounced the police’s crackdown against the Ferguson protesters as excessively militarized and repressive. We need to deal with this reality, in the same way that we need to deal with the reality that Proud Boys and Patriot Prayer include people of color in significant numbers and (in the latter case) in positions of leadership. Not because this makes such groups more “progressive,” but rather—as I emphasize in the August 2015 piece—because it makes them potentially more dangerous.Matthew N Lyonshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15664330735255207352noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13622622.post-83710350435808821582019-03-11T16:44:39.834-04:002019-03-11T16:44:39.834-04:00Regarding the Oath Keepers in Ferguson: You seem t...Regarding the Oath Keepers in Ferguson: You seem to conflate arming to defend the right to protest with arming to defend property rights of businesses against the protesters. The Oath Keepers' example of the Deacons for Defense of Justice is a complete distortion of history. The Deacons were armed to defend the protesters against racist violence, not to defend businesses. And the call of some Oath Keepers' for arming black men was the same. It was an attempt to organize what would have amounted to a black vigilante movement against the protesters, especially anybody who might engage in property violence.<br /><br />The Oath Keepers were not an ally of the Ferguson protesters in any sense of the word. They were there to do what the police could not do.John Reimannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03581191279457208652noreply@blogger.com